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Post by Esmeralda on Sept 26, 2019 18:17:28 GMT -5
Think again. I have the "Book of Three: the Official Companion to the Hit Show", written by Diana G. Gallagher and Paul Ruditis, and on Page 206, they have a conversation with Brad Kern. They start it this way:Both he and Connie were executive producers from the start, but Kern was always the showrunner. In the same book on Page 203 they have a conversation with Aaron Spelling and E. Duke Vincent. Here's how THAT conversation started:
Not sure I agree with them, but this should get Tim to admit that he's wrong, that Kern was the showrunner throughout the entire series.
I wish they had a conversation with Connie, but they didn't. I have a hunch when they kicked her out along with lots of the writers who were there from the start that she turned her back on the baby they murdered and then put their own baby into the time slot, the one I'll always call "The Perils of Poor, Poor Pitiful Piper" aka "PhoeME and Her Fantasy Men" aka "Two Witches Plus One Living Whitelighter Equals the Power of Three?" Others call it "Witchlighter" and/or "King Wyatt", which also fits. I hated that they made having a whitelighter as a father more important than having a Warren for a mother.
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Post by Esmeralda on Sept 26, 2019 19:27:18 GMT -5
You and me, both! Oh, I definitely count Bane as one of hers! If she didn't die, I've always imagined Bane getting off for good behavior and him proposing to Prue. Andy was just her first love/the boy next door, while Jack was a wonderful rebound guy. I always want to match Prue with Bane, the way I'd match Piper with Mark from 'Dead Man Dating', Phoebe with Drake and Paige with Leo! So did I. I'm guessing it would've been if the show wasn't picked up for the entire season. You are absolutely right about that! You can tell that Brad Kern was the showrunner! Show about girl power - yeah, right! Darn it! I thought I could finish this before I had to go to work - no such luck! But gotta say I LOVE your way of getting around ProBoards deleting quotes that are within quotes when you quote them![/quote]And now I'm back from work, so I can finish responding. I did, too. Like I said, I HATE the fact that their destiny changed from being the protector of the innocents to the vanquishers of anyone who they thought was evil. I don’t. I wish she never had a child – she was a HORRIBLE mother! I truly think that SHE'S the true "demon" who turned Wyatt evil with her horrible example of using her magic for personal gain and never getting a backlash. It's the only reason why I wish my favorite episode 'Morality Bites' never aired - it's why they ended up having her as mother. I will always believe that had Ted King not decided to leave the series, Piper would've been the one with all of the restaurants rather than Prue with all the Buckland's and Prue and Andy would be the ones who are divorced with a daughter who would have no whitelighter powers. Maybe that way IF they forced Piper to have kids they would only have Warren powers since they're not dead, just like Paige would only have Prue's power which would work just like hers. So does Alyssa; Shannen, too, despite her battle with breast cancer. Rose and Brian, well, that’s another story… I haven't seen any recent pictures of Julian so I don't know if he's aging well or not. But you're right. I'm glad that both Fuller and Ramsey are now too old to play Wyatt and Chris unless they were the ones with teenaged children! They both did not do a good job playing their parts at all, ESPECIALLY Fuller! I wish they'd chosen and actor who could ACT like a Halliwell, not just LOOK like a Halliwell. Ditto for McGowan. From what I’ve read, they wanted to do that, but none of the networks would pick it up – they didn’t want the stars to “be that old”. I loved the idea so much, that I came up with my own beginning. Here’s what I wrote at that time: Been having fun imagining what the credits for this new retcon might be like. I'm sure most fans won't like at least a part of it (I know I don't...), but with what and who we're getting (if we get Holly...) it's what makes sense to me: We start with a quick Charmed refresher course with Alyssa narrating S1, Holly narrating S2, and Shannen narrating S3, including the ending of that season, but Shannen continues with "But what if it Season Four started differently..." and we see the title card: "Charmed: What Could've Been".
Then a quick CGI-version of a different beginning to Season Four with all three surviving and not only vanquishing Shax, but also vanquishing the Source from Season Three, not Half-Face.
Then Shannen say "And now we each have a daughter."
Then Holly says, "And although one of their fathers was an angel who's now an Elder..." (We see Piper with Leo)
Then Alyssa says, "...and one was a half-demon who died to save us..." (We see Phoebe with Cole)
And then Shannen says, "...and one was a mortal who's back in jail, (We see Prue with Bane) all three of them are Warren witches with only Warren powers (and we see the three girls), who can never be Charmed because they're cousins, not sisters, but are the ones chosen to carry on the Warren Destiny while we're the ones now chosen to teach them how to do it," which leads into the actual credits. Kinda hokey, but kinda fun. What do you think of that? THAT's how I'd want Charmed to come back! No Leo, no Cole, No Paige, no Wyatt, no Chris, no Billie, no Christy and no slampieces for Phoebe - just the three girls living in the Manor with each of them having just one daughter before they lost their husbands sounds absolutely HEAVENLY to me. Oh, you’re absolutely right that I would NOT want Holly or Alyssa to be in charge of something like that – I HATED their idealized version of Piper and Phoebe. And, obviously I wouldn’t want to have Kern anywhere near it! Over at the Charmed Café, my friends and I had a blast coming up with our own version of a reboot, featuring the Warrens: a matriarch named Prudence with two daughters: Patience and Paige, and Patience had two daughters, Piper and Phoebe. All very similar to their namesake (with Prudence a combination of Prue and Penny), but different. And we said that Connie created it and became executive producer and showrunner while the episodes were written by Sheryl J. Anderson, Paul Ruditis, and the team of Chris Levinson and Zack Estrin. We had so much fun with that, that, no, I’d never want Charmed the Original Series to seriously return one day because no way I can imagine it as good as our series! Oh, that’s so cool that you’re also doing a marathon re-watch! We started ours when the rip-off (I refuse to call it either Charmed or the reboot..) got started and are almost done re-re-watching Season One and will start Season Two on Saturday October 12th and Sunday October 13th. Can’t wait! Can’t wait to read what you think of it! Actually they’re all about the same age, but back when Charmed started, Ted LOOKED older than Phoebe. I could believe he was Prue’s age, but not Phoebe’s. Yup. I think the Big Bad of each season should be in the credits, too, like Carlos Gomez - who played Rodriguez was one of the co-stars of Season One. I also included the significant others as costars. Obviously I really think so – it’s the real reason why I matched them; I just didn’t want to spoil it after you read Season One and before you read Season Two. Yeah, I hated them forcing that – it so took away from the fun of cliffhangers except (as you said) the Season Three one. I'm VERY curious to find out what you think of how I ended my Dream Season Three!
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Post by Carina on Sept 26, 2019 21:37:22 GMT -5
Hi guys, I'm going to reply to each of separately in another post, and then respond to the third season of The Dream Charmed. TIM SAID: Same here. I have it that FF.net alerts me whenever she adds a new chapter.
CARINA SAID: Good idea.
TIM SAID: Me too. Worse when they become what TV Tropes calls a Dead Fic (a story that will never be completed). CARINA SAID: *nods* sounds about right.
TIM SAID: It was. In case the series had been cancelled, it would have nicely wrapped things up.
CARINA SAID: It would have wrapped things up nicely.
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Post by Carina on Sept 26, 2019 22:12:29 GMT -5
CARINA SAID: ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, I definitely count Bane as one of hers! If she didn't die, I've always imagined Bane getting off for good behavior and him proposing to Prue. Andy was just her first love/the boy next door, while Jack was a wonderful rebound guy. I always want to match Prue with Bane, the way I'd match Piper with Mark from 'Dead Man Dating', Phoebe with Drake and Paige with Leo! CARINA SAID: I could see that happening, I wonder if Shannen didn't get fired, if Bane was planned to return. But, I'll always wonder if Andy may have come back later in some way. I've always imagined the 100th episode of Charmed, Centennial Charmed, if Prue didn't die, being a celebration of the series that brings back Andy, and possibly does a different alternate universe where Andy and Patty didn't die. One of the biggest missed opportunities was doing an alternate universe plot where family members were not dead. I can see why that idea slipped through their fingers, when Shannen was fired. No way you can do it without showing Prue alive. But, if she didn't get fired, or left on better terms, that is what I'd want for a milestone event story. ESMERALDA SAID: So did I. I'm guessing it would've been if the show wasn't picked up for the entire season. CARINA SAID: Makes sense doesn't it. ESMERALDA SAID: You are absolutely right about that! You can tell that Brad Kern was the showrunner! Show about girl power - yeah, right! CARINA SAID: That always is frustrating isn't it, when the show had a man in charge of girl power, or one who didn't understand it. Doing my First Season marathon, I'm shocked to see how true this was in the first season, goes to show you that even though I can't stand Kern, him and Connie make a good team, but sadly the longer it kept going, the show was always bound to have Kern ruin it. I just don't know, how possible it would be, for them both to get along with their differences in how they saw Charmed, even if Connie didn't leave in Season Three, it still sadly may have always led to the two clashing. It is too bad, Connie's sisters didn't get some input, if they both writers like their younger sister Connie, imagine how the three of them could write Charmed, with each sister writing for one of the sisters based on themselves. I would love to learn more about Connie, I've never seen too many interviews with her, but I'm interested to learn more on her thought process for coming up with the sisters. CARINA SAID: Thank you, I wanted to make sure, I could know who said what, with the quotes eventually getting too confusing to figure out later, when they disappear. ESMERALDA SAID: I did, too. Like I said, I HATE the fact that their destiny changed from being the protector of the innocents to the vanquishers of anyone who they thought was evil. CARINA SAID: It really took the balance the show did so well in the earlier seasons. And the whole protecting of the innocent was clearly stated as important in the early seasons. I guess when Connie left, Kern tried to make Charmed more like other shows, and wanted it to be like the other WB hits. If all the talent went out the door in the writing department, It does make sense, why we ended up with the show we did in S4-S8. Anybody new coming to the writers room, would only hear Kern's bible of the shows history, without Connie present. Such a shame, isn't it, Esmeralda. ESMERALDA SAID: I don’t. I wish she never had a child – she was a HORRIBLE mother! I truly think that SHE'S the true "demon" who turned Wyatt evil with her horrible example of using her magic for personal gain and never getting a backlash. It's the only reason why I wish my favorite episode 'Morality Bites' never aired - it's why they ended up having her as mother. CARINA SAID: You bring up a good point about 'Morality Bites'. I've gotten so used to seeing Piper as a mother and wife, that her character is hard to see as anything else in S4-S8. And she was such an annoying nag in S6-S8. I'll blame Holly for that, when she got that producer credit. CARINA SAID: That would have been a much more balanced series, if we got that. Sometimes, I wish the only magical beings were the Charmed Ones, when you added in Leo, and the whitelighter children, and to a lesser extent Cole. It took away so much focus off the sisters. In my Season One marathon rewatching, I am so surprised by how much the attention is on the sisters, and I'm trying not to think about the later seasons, but it just makes sad. I'll wonder, how things would play out this way, would they have still fired Shannen, especially if her character was so tied to a major relationship in Andy, if Leo wasn't around, and it were Piper as the sister single. Especially if it were Andy and Prue married in S3. It is interesting, how it was easy to remove Prue and Kern fire Shannen, her character wasn't with anybody, that it wouldn't ruin any existing ties to a co-star. But we'll never know. ESMERALDA SAID: So does Alyssa; Shannen, too, despite her battle with breast cancer. Rose and Brian, well, that’s another story… I haven't seen any recent pictures of Julian so I don't know if he's aging well or not. CARINA SAID: Your right about those two, they look great. Shannen does too, I've seen pics of her online from her 90210 and she looks fantastic, better than her other cast members. What happened to Rose and Brian, they look terrible. I think I've seen a photo of Julian, and he doesn't look that great either. CARINA SAID: Me too, I really wished they did. The casting for the most part for series regulars in the later seasons wasn't that great, same with Billie. ESMERALDA SAID: From what I’ve read, they wanted to do that, but none of the networks would pick it up – they didn’t want the stars to “be that old”. I loved the idea so much, that I came up with my own beginning. Here’s what I wrote at that time: CARINA SAID: That is too bad, I would have watched a set-up like this. Been having fun imagining what the credits for this new retcon might be like. I'm sure most fans won't like at least a part of it (I know I don't...), but with what and who we're getting (if we get Holly...) it's what makes sense to me: We start with a quick Charmed refresher course with Alyssa narrating S1, Holly narrating S2, and Shannen narrating S3, including the ending of that season, but Shannen continues with "But what if it Season Four started differently..." and we see the title card: "Charmed: What Could've Been".
Then a quick CGI-version of a different beginning to Season Four with all three surviving and not only vanquishing Shax, but also vanquishing the Source from Season Three, not Half-Face.
Then Shannen say "And now we each have a daughter."
Then Holly says, "And although one of their fathers was an angel who's now an Elder..." (We see Piper with Leo)
Then Alyssa says, "...and one was a half-demon who died to save us..." (We see Phoebe with Cole)
And then Shannen says, "...and one was a mortal who's back in jail, (We see Prue with Bane) all three of them are Warren witches with only Warren powers (and we see the three girls), who can never be Charmed because they're cousins, not sisters, but are the ones chosen to carry on the Warren Destiny while we're the ones now chosen to teach them how to do it," which leads into the actual credits. Kinda hokey, but kinda fun. ESMERALDA SAID: What do you think of that? THAT's how I'd want Charmed to come back! No Leo, no Cole, No Paige, no Wyatt, no Chris, no Billie, no Christy and no slampieces for Phoebe - just the three girls living in the Manor with each of them having just one daughter before they lost their husbands sounds absolutely HEAVENLY to me. CARINA SAID: You won me over, that would have been really great. Taking it back to girl power and how the show should have been. ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, you’re absolutely right that I would NOT want Holly or Alyssa to be in charge of something like that – I HATED their idealized version of Piper and Phoebe. And, obviously I wouldn’t want to have Kern anywhere near it! CARINA SAID: Ditto to all of that. CARINA SAID: That would have been a great series, I'd watch something like that. I love that you brought back the good writers of Charmed. I've got to find this series to read one-time. I agree, I can't see it living up to the original series, so best to let Charmed stay ended. If they want to bring it back, I hope it happens when all of us are long gone, and all the original fans are dead or too old to watch. ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, that’s so cool that you’re also doing a marathon re-watch! We started ours when the rip-off (I refuse to call it either Charmed or the reboot..) got started and are almost done re-re-watching Season One and will start Season Two on Saturday October 12th and Sunday October 13th. Can’t wait! CARINA SAID: It is, and I'm so glad StoryGirl has created threads for all of Season One, so I can post my reviews here. That is so exiting that you are going something similar. ESMERALDA: Can’t wait to read what you think of it! CARINA SAID: ESMERALDA SAID: Actually they’re all about the same age, but back when Charmed started, Ted LOOKED older than Phoebe. I could believe he was Prue’s age, but not Phoebe’s. CARINA SAID: I see, thanks, wasn't sure about how exact ages. ESMERALDA SAID:Yup. I think the Big Bad of each season should be in the credits, too, like Carlos Gomez - who played Rodriguez was one of the co-stars of Season One. I also included the significant others as costars. CARINA SAID: ESMERALDA SAID: Obviously I really think so – it’s the real reason why I matched them; I just didn’t want to spoil it after you read Season One and before you read Season Two. CARINA SAID: Thanks for doing that, was a nice surprise. ESMERALDA SAID: Yeah, I hated them forcing that – it so took away from the fun of cliffhangers except (as you said) the Season Three one. I'm VERY curious to find out what you think of how I ended my Dream Season Three! CARINA SAID: Lets find out now, when I post Season Three in a new post. So this reply post doesn't get too long.
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Post by Carina on Sept 26, 2019 22:24:27 GMT -5
SEASON THREE Starring Shannen Doherty, Holly Marie Combs and Alyssa Milano Costarring Brian Krause, Chris Boyd and Julian McMahon Leo has now been missing for three months and Piper has done everything she can think of to bring him back. Since she's failed, she goes on strike, just like she did in the beginning of Canon Season Three, and just like then, it's when she's almost the cause of a young girl losing her life that she changes her mind and helps save both the little girl and the fairy. I'm very happy to see Leo has been missing for three months and during most of summer. Really didn't like and rolled my eyes, he came back right away in the next episode. I think you having it be at the end of Season Two, and a jump of a few months with him gone, fits so much well. I'm glad she changes her mind and saves the girl. But it is good set-up for Season Three's start. Now this would have been better than canon, I like this change. I don't know why when Leo got his wings back in Murphy's Luck, why he and Piper insisted to keep trying to make it work, she insisted on her normal life all the time, and why, her picking Dan over Leo, makes more sense. It felt like Leo loved helping people, shouldn't that go above a relationship with Piper. I like the way you did it here. That is good, he can help people as a doctor and heal them with regular human means, not powers. Leo taking Canon Dan's role is interesting. Now Piper can stop complaining, she has her semi-normal relationship now. I can see a big Church Wedding for them. Prue and Cole, I should have guessed this was happening, since Prue had nobody yet. He sounds like a scary guy in this one. I'm glad Prue has enough sense to not lie to her sisters, unlike Phoebe. I wanted to strange Phoebe for doing that. The worst arc of S3, was the Phoebe lying to her sisters arc. This is scary even more. Now that is a good time for Shax to attack, at a wedding, and get rid of Prue's subplot. I'm glad they did, having Phoebe disconnected from them is a bad writing move Kern did. Now I like her summoning him better than Phoebe leaving for the Underworld the whole finale. The Seer is here. I like that Phoebe remembers, but a nice callback to Deja Vu. That is a shocking cliffhanger.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2019 23:48:35 GMT -5
Hyde School Reunion was the worst offender here, Phoebe and Paige murdered a man! Okay, demons did the actual killing, but Phoebe and Paige made it happen. In any court of law, they're just as guilty.
Kernus is finished in Hollywood, thanks to MeToo. He got canned off NCIS New Orleans.
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Post by Esmeralda on Sept 27, 2019 8:07:55 GMT -5
CARINA SAID: They could have been a fun pairing, not at all, I don't mind, especially when Phoebe started to become annoying with having so many men, as did all the sisters. It's interesting how few Prue had, although she was only in three seasons, but she had the least major love interests. Only two major ones, Andy and Jack, and maybe Bane. ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, I definitely count Bane as one of hers! If she didn't die, I've always imagined Bane getting off for good behavior and him proposing to Prue. Andy was just her first love/the boy next door, while Jack was a wonderful rebound guy. I always want to match Prue with Bane, the way I'd match Piper with Mark from 'Dead Man Dating', Phoebe with Drake and Paige with Leo! CARINA SAID: I could see that happening, I wonder if Shannen didn't get fired, if Bane was planned to return. But, I'll always wonder if Andy may have come back later in some way. I've always imagined the 100th episode of Charmed, Centennial Charmed, if Prue didn't die, being a celebration of the series that brings back Andy, and possibly does a different alternate universe where Andy and Patty didn't die. ESMERALDA SAID: That would’ve been very nice, but obviously you couldn’t once Shannen refused to have her image shown after she was fired. I still think that Kern didn’t know that, and that messed everything up much more than anything else. ESMERALDA: SAID: *nods* Exactly. I’ll always wish that Aaron Spelling hadn’t added that to Shannen’s contract. I’m sure that’s why they had her outfit in ‘All Hell Breaks Loose’ be similar to the one in ‘Bride and Gloom’ – just like fans have done, they would’ve used that to show Prue dead, something they couldn’t do thanks to that clause in Shannen’s contract. CARINA SAID: That mind-control power was pretty impressive, and when I re-watched 'Wicca Envy', that episode felt like a series finale or season finale to me. ESMERALDA SAID: So did I. I'm guessing it would've been if the show wasn't picked up for the entire season. CARINA SAID: Makes sense doesn't it. ESMERALDA SAID: Definitely! ESMERALDA SAID: You are absolutely right about that! You can tell that Brad Kern was the showrunner! Show about girl power - yeah, right! CARINA SAID: That always is frustrating isn't it, when the show had a man in charge of girl power, or one who didn't understand it. Doing my First Season marathon, I'm shocked to see how true this was in the first season, goes to show you that even though I can't stand Kern, him and Connie make a good team, but sadly the longer it kept going, the show was always bound to have Kern ruin it. I just don't know, how possible it would be, for them both to get along with their differences in how they saw Charmed, even if Connie didn't leave in Season Three, it still sadly may have always led to the two clashing. ESMERALDA SAID: That’s what’s been funny to me during our re-watches. I don’t love episodes that either Connie or Brad wrote themselves, but I love the ones that they write together! ESMERALDA SAID: No, from what I’ve read, neither of her sisters are writers, but they gave Connie plenty of input. ESMERALDA SAID: That would be fantastic, but it does appear that she wants nothing to do with Charmed, the same way the writers who were let go after Season Three don’t. I’d love to know more about what my favorite writer, Sheryl J. Anderson, thought of it, but when I tried contacting her for the anniversary, she didn’t reply back. CARINA SAID: Thank you, I wanted to make sure, I could know who said what, with the quotes eventually getting too confusing to figure out later, when they disappear. ESMERALDA SAID: And I think I figured out an even better way of doing it! You’ll have to let me know what you think of doing it this way. Just quoting the start of each topic should make it easier to find what we’re talking about when we go later go back. And now I'm back from work, so I can finish responding. ESMERALDA SAID: EXACTLY! I HATED that the canon "Angel" (I call him the Demon of Destiny) gave them their choice right after the sisters saved an innocent. And instead of letting them continue their TRUE destiny of saving innocents, he turned it into vanquishing Source and (after he changed Prudence Melinda into Wyatt Matthew - my explanation for the change) gave them a new destiny - protecting the Twice-Blessed Brat. No, I don't like the Canon Charmed Sons at all, but I do like fanfics that make them likeable.[/quote]CARINA SAID: Yeah, that bugs me, how the innocents were no longer important. I missed those. ESMERALDA SAID: I did, too. Like I said, I HATE the fact that their destiny changed from being the protector of the innocents to the vanquishers of anyone who they thought was evil. CARINA SAID: It really took the balance the show did so well in the earlier seasons. And the whole protecting of the innocent was clearly stated as important in the early seasons. ESMERALDA SAID: And again that’s why I count S4-28 as an alternate-universe spin-off where only the names of the characters are the same. ESMERALDA SAID: Yes, it really is. But I wonder how much of that was Kern and how much of it was The WB. They’d just lost Buffy to UPN and to me was trying to make Charmed be more like Buffy in order to keep fans at The WB. Personally, I always count The WB as the Source with Kern as Shax. ESMERALDA SAID: I don’t. I wish she never had a child – she was a HORRIBLE mother! I truly think that SHE'S the true "demon" who turned Wyatt evil with her horrible example of using her magic for personal gain and never getting a backlash. It's the only reason why I wish my favorite episode 'Morality Bites' never aired - it's why they ended up having her as mother. CARINA SAID: You bring up a good point about 'Morality Bites'. I've gotten so used to seeing Piper as a mother and wife, that her character is hard to see as anything else in S4-S8. And she was such an annoying nag in S6-S8. I'll blame Holly for that, when she got that producer credit. ESMERALDA SAID: AMEN!!! She always hit me as a horrible mother in S5-S8 and I always thought she never should’ve been one. CARINA SAID: That would have been a much more balanced series, if we got that. Sometimes, I wish the only magical beings were the Charmed Ones, when you added in Leo, and the whitelighter children, and to a lesser extent Cole. It took away so much focus off the sisters. In my Season One marathon rewatching, I am so surprised by how much the attention is on the sisters, and I'm trying not to think about the later seasons, but it just makes sad. I'll wonder, how things would play out this way, would they have still fired Shannen, especially if her character was so tied to a major relationship in Andy, if Leo wasn't around, and it were Piper as the sister single. Especially if it were Andy and Prue married in S3. It is interesting, how it was easy to remove Prue and Kern fire Shannen, her character wasn't with anybody, that it wouldn't ruin any existing ties to a co-star. But we'll never know. ESMERALDA SAID: No, we won’t. I think they still would’ve fired her. She was too strong and Kern couldn’t allow a woman having power—see what happened with Connie and all of those female writers. Andy as a widower could’ve made a fantastic storyline (much better than the Cole the Source/Phoebe the Queen one – my least-favorite storyline) and helped make it more male-centric, which, of course, is what Kern wanted. ESMERALDA SAID: You're right. I'm glad that both Fuller and Ramsey are now too old to play Wyatt and Chris unless they were the ones with teenaged children! They both did not do a good job playing their parts at all, ESPECIALLY Fuller! I wish they'd chosen and actor who could ACT like a Halliwell, not just LOOK like a Halliwell. Ditto for McGowan. CARINA SAID: Me too, I really wished they did. The casting for the most part for series regulars in the later seasons wasn't that great, same with Billie. ESMERALDA SAID: AMEN! Hiring a comedic actress to play a dramatic role was a HORRIBLE decision! So glad Kern’s spin-off “Billie, the Teenaged Thuperwitch” never made it on air. ESMERALDA SAID: From what I’ve read, they wanted to do that, but none of the networks would pick it up – they didn’t want the stars to “be that old”. I loved the idea so much, that I came up with my own beginning. Here’s what I wrote at that time: Been having fun imagining what the credits for this new retcon might be like. I'm sure most fans won't like at least a part of it (I know I don't...), but with what and who we're getting (if we get Holly...) it's what makes sense to me: We start with a quick Charmed refresher course with Alyssa narrating S1, Holly narrating S2, and Shannen narrating S3, including the ending of that season, but Shannen continues with "But what if it Season Four started differently..." and we see the title card: "Charmed: What Could've Been".
Then a quick CGI-version of a different beginning to Season Four with all three surviving and not only vanquishing Shax, but also vanquishing the Source from Season Three, not Half-Face.
Then Shannen say "And now we each have a daughter."
Then Holly says, "And although one of their fathers was an angel who's now an Elder..." (We see Piper with Leo)
Then Alyssa says, "...and one was a half-demon who died to save us..." (We see Phoebe with Cole)
And then Shannen says, "...and one was a mortal who's back in jail, (We see Prue with Bane) all three of them are Warren witches with only Warren powers (and we see the three girls), who can never be Charmed because they're cousins, not sisters, but are the ones chosen to carry on the Warren Destiny while we're the ones now chosen to teach them how to do it," which leads into the actual credits. Kinda hokey, but kinda fun. ESMERALDA SAID: What do you think of that? THAT's how I'd want Charmed to come back! No Leo, no Cole, No Paige, no Wyatt, no Chris, no Billie, no Christy and no slampieces for Phoebe - just the three girls living in the Manor with each of them having just one daughter before they lost their husbands sounds absolutely HEAVENLY to me. CARINA SAID: You won me over, that would have been really great. Taking it back to girl power and how the show should have been. ESMERALDA SAID: Exactly! ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, you’re absolutely right that I would NOT want Holly or Alyssa to be in charge of something like that – I HATED their idealized version of Piper and Phoebe. And, obviously I wouldn’t want to have Kern anywhere near it! CARINA SAID: Ditto to all of that. ESMERALDA SAID: CARINA SAID: That would have been a great series, I'd watch something like that. I love that you brought back the good writers of Charmed. I've got to find this series to read one-time. I agree, I can't see it living up to the original series, so best to let Charmed stay ended. If they want to bring it back, I hope it happens when all of us are long gone, and all the original fans are dead or too old to watch. ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, that’s so cool that you’re also doing a marathon re-watch! We started ours when the rip-off (I refuse to call it either Charmed or the reboot..) got started and are almost done re-re-watching Season One and will start Season Two on Saturday October 12th and Sunday October 13th. Can’t wait! CARINA SAID: It is, and I'm so glad StoryGirl has created threads for all of Season One, so I can post my reviews here. That is so exiting that you are going something similar. ESMERALDA SAID: Can’t wait to read what you think of it! CARINA SAID: ESMERALDA SAID: Actually they’re all about the same age, but back when Charmed started, Ted LOOKED older than Phoebe. I could believe he was Prue’s age, but not Phoebe’s. CARINA SAID: I see, thanks, wasn't sure about how exact ages. ESMERALDA SAID: I’m not sure either; I just know they’re all close in age, but don’t look it. ESMERALDA SAID: Obviously I really think so – it’s the real reason why I matched them; I just didn’t want to spoil it after you read Season One and before you read Season Two. CARINA SAID: Thanks for doing that, was a nice surprise. ESMERALDA SAID: I’ll try to always do that. I’m glad it was a nice surprise. ESMERALDA SAID: Yeah, I hated them forcing that – it so took away from the fun of cliffhangers except (as you said) the Season Three one. I'm VERY curious to find out what you think of how I ended my Dream Season Three! CARINA SAID: Lets find out now, when I post Season Three in a new post. So this reply post doesn't get too long. ESMERALDA SAID: VERY good idea, especially because I have to get to work. I’ll let you know that I’m going to be VERY busy with Real Life this weekend, so if I don’t reply to you, that is why. If you have time, feel free to keep reading and replying – and putting each chapter in a different post so these don’t get too long is a fantastic idea! Have a great weekend!
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Post by Carina on Sept 27, 2019 20:33:24 GMT -5
TIM SAID: Hyde School Reunion was the worst offender here, Phoebe and Paige murdered a man! Okay, demons did the actual killing, but Phoebe and Paige made it happen. In any court of law, they're just as guilty.
One of my least favorite episodes, and so upset with Phoebe and Paige, they should have known better, especially Phoebe. Season 6 they did so many things that made me roll my eyes and be very disappointed in them.
Kernus is finished in Hollywood, thanks to MeToo. He got canned off NCIS New Orleans. From another site:
CARINA SAID: And no doubt, he'll never respond. I'm just shocked this has gone on this long and nobody said anything. I can see why he fired Shannen, she may be the only one who would stand up to him, or disagreed with his direction of the show, or made suggestions and or complained, and he fired her because she was a bit*ch in his eyes and going how dare does this woman tell me what to do. Looks like Kern is truly the reason why so many writers were fired or quit. I feel so sorry for all the writers. So Sheryl J. Anderson quit, I think she liked writing for Prue the most, but perhaps after Shannen was fired and what happened to Connie, it was too much, and she wanted to get out of that toxic writers room asap.
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Post by Carina on Sept 27, 2019 21:07:35 GMT -5
CARINA SAID: They could have been a fun pairing, not at all, I don't mind, especially when Phoebe started to become annoying with having so many men, as did all the sisters. It's interesting how few Prue had, although she was only in three seasons, but she had the least major love interests. Only two major ones, Andy and Jack, and maybe Bane. ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, I definitely count Bane as one of hers! If she didn't die, I've always imagined Bane getting off for good behavior and him proposing to Prue. Andy was just her first love/the boy next door, while Jack was a wonderful rebound guy. I always want to match Prue with Bane, the way I'd match Piper with Mark from 'Dead Man Dating', Phoebe with Drake and Paige with Leo! CARINA SAID: I could see that happening, I wonder if Shannen didn't get fired, if Bane was planned to return. But, I'll always wonder if Andy may have come back later in some way. I've always imagined the 100th episode of Charmed, Centennial Charmed, if Prue didn't die, being a celebration of the series that brings back Andy, and possibly does a different alternate universe where Andy and Patty didn't die. ESMERALDA SAID: That would’ve been very nice, but obviously you couldn’t once Shannen refused to have her image shown after she was fired. I still think that Kern didn’t know that, and that messed everything up much more than anything else. CARINA SAID: Yeah, that is true, and it is too bad, I'd have loved if she could have had her image shown and some old footage used. Too bad. It still bugs me, that the Charmed books couldn't use her, and do stories with her set in S4-S8, or even done a novel showing what happened between S3 and S4. Oh, well! ESMERALDA: SAID: *nods* Exactly. I’ll always wish that Aaron Spelling hadn’t added that to Shannen’s contract. I’m sure that’s why they had her outfit in ‘All Hell Breaks Loose’ be similar to the one in ‘Bride and Gloom’ – just like fans have done, they would’ve used that to show Prue dead, something they couldn’t do thanks to that clause in Shannen’s contract. CARINA SAID: Me too. It's too bad, that thanks to the clause in her contract, that wasn't possible. Because, you could have shown us what happened between Season 3 and Season 4, using old footage, and or them creating a dummy in Shannen's likeness to be used as her dead body, and or used for her coffin scenes in the church, as multiple shows have done when needing to use a character after they had died, but not bringing back the actor to just play dead. CARINA SAID: That mind-control power was pretty impressive, and when I re-watched 'Wicca Envy', that episode felt like a series finale or season finale to me. ESMERALDA SAID: So did I. I'm guessing it would've been if the show wasn't picked up for the entire season. CARINA SAID: Makes sense doesn't it. ESMERALDA SAID: Definitely! CARINA SAID: ESMERALDA SAID: You are absolutely right about that! You can tell that Brad Kern was the showrunner! Show about girl power - yeah, right! CARINA SAID: That always is frustrating isn't it, when the show had a man in charge of girl power, or one who didn't understand it. Doing my First Season marathon, I'm shocked to see how true this was in the first season, goes to show you that even though I can't stand Kern, him and Connie make a good team, but sadly the longer it kept going, the show was always bound to have Kern ruin it. I just don't know, how possible it would be, for them both to get along with their differences in how they saw Charmed, even if Connie didn't leave in Season Three, it still sadly may have always led to the two clashing. ESMERALDA SAID: That’s what’s been funny to me during our re-watches. I don’t love episodes that either Connie or Brad wrote themselves, but I love the ones that they write together! CARINA SAID: Your right about that. I didn't like Dream Sorcerer or I've Got You Under My Skin. I posted my review for the first episode, and going to do I've Got You Under My Skin when I can, and have lots of thoughts on that one. I did really like Secrets and Guys, which was an episode done by Brad, Connie and Sheryl, I believe. ESMERALDA SAID: No, from what I’ve read, neither of her sisters are writers, but they gave Connie plenty of input. CARINA: Thanks. Glad she gave them input, I'll be curious if any of the sisterly scenes in Season One were based on them with sisterly plots. The Majority Rules seemed to be a constant sisterly part of Which Prue is It Anyway, that I just finished. And I couldn't help wondering, if that is what happened with Connie and her sisters. ESMERALDA SAID: That would be fantastic, but it does appear that she wants nothing to do with Charmed, the same way the writers who were let go after Season Three don’t. I’d love to know more about what my favorite writer, Sheryl J. Anderson, thought of it, but when I tried contacting her for the anniversary, she didn’t reply back. CARINA SAID: That would be so exciting, but like you said, most of them want nothing to do with Charmed, thanks Kern. That's too bad, she didn't respond. Really sad. Oh, well. There is a convention next year for a show I used to love watching growing up, and in that convention they even have a couple of writers attending, not just actors. And, made me think of Charmed, since, I'd much rather pick apart the brain of a writer, than an actor, who would only talk about the filming, and not give the answers, as a fan, I'd be wanting. CARINA SAID: Thank you, I wanted to make sure, I could know who said what, with the quotes eventually getting too confusing to figure out later, when they disappear. ESMERALDA SAID: CARINA SAID: I love that you did it this way, much easier to follow the comments. ESMERALDA SAID: And now I'm back from work, so I can finish responding. ESMERALDA SAID: EXACTLY! I HATED that the canon "Angel" (I call him the Demon of Destiny) gave them their choice right after the sisters saved an innocent. And instead of letting them continue their TRUE destiny of saving innocents, he turned it into vanquishing Source and (after he changed Prudence Melinda into Wyatt Matthew - my explanation for the change) gave them a new destiny - protecting the Twice-Blessed Brat. No, I don't like the Canon Charmed Sons at all, but I do like fanfics that make them likeable.[/quote]CARINA SAID: Yeah, that bugs me, how the innocents were no longer important. I missed those. ESMERALDA SAID: I did, too. Like I said, I HATE the fact that their destiny changed from being the protector of the innocents to the vanquishers of anyone who they thought was evil. CARINA SAID: It really took the balance the show did so well in the earlier seasons. And the whole protecting of the innocent was clearly stated as important in the early seasons. ESMERALDA SAID: And again that’s why I count S4-28 as an alternate-universe spin-off where only the names of the characters are the same. CARINA SAID: Which makes sense, since it was no longer based on Connie and her sisters, but Kern's Charmed Ones, where he only used the names of the characters. I'll bet Holly and Brian love Kern's Charmed Ones than Connie's, because it let them get starring roles. Did you think Season 5-8 became all about them. It didn't feel like Phoebe or Paige were important, apart from giving them love interest plots. They didn't give them equal story like Season 1 and Season 2. ESMERALDA SAID: Yes, it really is. But I wonder how much of that was Kern and how much of it was The WB. They’d just lost Buffy to UPN and to me was trying to make Charmed be more like Buffy in order to keep fans at The WB. Personally, I always count The WB as the Source with Kern as Shax. CARINA SAID: You might be right about that. Wouldn't be surprised. Especially, since I felt like P3 was something The WB wanted. It made no sense in character for Piper to want a club, when she talked about opening a club in Season 2, I said to myself, that doesn't sound like Piper at all. ESMERALDA SAID: I don’t. I wish she never had a child – she was a HORRIBLE mother! I truly think that SHE'S the true "demon" who turned Wyatt evil with her horrible example of using her magic for personal gain and never getting a backlash. It's the only reason why I wish my favorite episode 'Morality Bites' never aired - it's why they ended up having her as mother. CARINA SAID: You bring up a good point about 'Morality Bites'. I've gotten so used to seeing Piper as a mother and wife, that her character is hard to see as anything else in S4-S8. And she was such an annoying nag in S6-S8. I'll blame Holly for that, when she got that producer credit. ESMERALDA SAID: AMEN!!! She always hit me as a horrible mother in S5-S8 and I always thought she never should’ve been one. CARINA SAID: I know fans seem to adore that Piper so much, and I never understood why. The only sister, I liked when the show ended was Paige, but she got on my nerves during Season 5 and 6, when she quit her job, and did those temp jobs, and then creating a man for herself. CARINA SAID: That would have been a much more balanced series, if we got that. Sometimes, I wish the only magical beings were the Charmed Ones, when you added in Leo, and the whitelighter children, and to a lesser extent Cole. It took away so much focus off the sisters. In my Season One marathon rewatching, I am so surprised by how much the attention is on the sisters, and I'm trying not to think about the later seasons, but it just makes sad. I'll wonder, how things would play out this way, would they have still fired Shannen, especially if her character was so tied to a major relationship in Andy, if Leo wasn't around, and it were Piper as the sister single. Especially if it were Andy and Prue married in S3. It is interesting, how it was easy to remove Prue and Kern fire Shannen, her character wasn't with anybody, that it wouldn't ruin any existing ties to a co-star. But we'll never know. ESMERALDA SAID: No, we won’t. I think they still would’ve fired her. She was too strong and Kern couldn’t allow a woman having power—see what happened with Connie and all of those female writers. Andy as a widower could’ve made a fantastic storyline (much better than the Cole the Source/Phoebe the Queen one – my least-favorite storyline) and helped make it more male-centric, which, of course, is what Kern wanted. CARINA SAID: Yep, she was too strong and your right, I said something similar in another post somewhere, that Shannen was fired because she most likely disagreed with Kern, and he fired her for daring to question him. Andy as a widower could have been fun, he wasn't magical, so he couldn't steal the screen-time the way Leo did, being magical. And, it wasn't like he was just a boyfriend or husband, he grew up with the sisters, so he wouldn't just be written out. Yeah the Cole as the Source/Phoebe the Queen was a very disjointed storyline. I didn't get it half the time what they were doing, with is it really Cole or the Source possessing him. Also, didn't get how Phoebe could even be Queen, when she wasn't a demon, and how the other demons would even allow this. Been a while since I watched it. ESMERALDA SAID: You're right. I'm glad that both Fuller and Ramsey are now too old to play Wyatt and Chris unless they were the ones with teenaged children! They both did not do a good job playing their parts at all, ESPECIALLY Fuller! I wish they'd chosen and actor who could ACT like a Halliwell, not just LOOK like a Halliwell. Ditto for McGowan. CARINA SAID: Me too, I really wished they did. The casting for the most part for series regulars in the later seasons wasn't that great, same with Billie. ESMERALDA SAID: AMEN! Hiring a comedic actress to play a dramatic role was a HORRIBLE decision! So glad Kern’s spin-off “Billie, the Teenaged Thuperwitch” never made it on air. CARINA: I'm glad that never happened and he never got to make that spin-off. She is a great comedic actress though. ESMERALDA SAID: From what I’ve read, they wanted to do that, but none of the networks would pick it up – they didn’t want the stars to “be that old”. I loved the idea so much, that I came up with my own beginning. Here’s what I wrote at that time: CARINA SAID: That's too bad, go figure they use that old excuse of being too old. But, it didn't stop them bringing back Will & Grace or The X-Files. It was a good idea though. Been having fun imagining what the credits for this new retcon might be like. I'm sure most fans won't like at least a part of it (I know I don't...), but with what and who we're getting (if we get Holly...) it's what makes sense to me: We start with a quick Charmed refresher course with Alyssa narrating S1, Holly narrating S2, and Shannen narrating S3, including the ending of that season, but Shannen continues with "But what if it Season Four started differently..." and we see the title card: "Charmed: What Could've Been".
Then a quick CGI-version of a different beginning to Season Four with all three surviving and not only vanquishing Shax, but also vanquishing the Source from Season Three, not Half-Face.
Then Shannen say "And now we each have a daughter."
Then Holly says, "And although one of their fathers was an angel who's now an Elder..." (We see Piper with Leo)
Then Alyssa says, "...and one was a half-demon who died to save us..." (We see Phoebe with Cole)
And then Shannen says, "...and one was a mortal who's back in jail, (We see Prue with Bane) all three of them are Warren witches with only Warren powers (and we see the three girls), who can never be Charmed because they're cousins, not sisters, but are the ones chosen to carry on the Warren Destiny while we're the ones now chosen to teach them how to do it," which leads into the actual credits. Kinda hokey, but kinda fun. ESMERALDA SAID: What do you think of that? THAT's how I'd want Charmed to come back! No Leo, no Cole, No Paige, no Wyatt, no Chris, no Billie, no Christy and no slampieces for Phoebe - just the three girls living in the Manor with each of them having just one daughter before they lost their husbands sounds absolutely HEAVENLY to me. CARINA SAID: You won me over, that would have been really great. Taking it back to girl power and how the show should have been. ESMERALDA SAID: Exactly! CARINA SAID: And I hear this new Charmed reboot isn't about that, somewhere I read they have given all the sisters love interests already. ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, you’re absolutely right that I would NOT want Holly or Alyssa to be in charge of something like that – I HATED their idealized version of Piper and Phoebe. And, obviously I wouldn’t want to have Kern anywhere near it! CARINA SAID: Ditto to all of that. ESMERALDA SAID: CARINA SAID: CARINA SAID: That would have been a great series, I'd watch something like that. I love that you brought back the good writers of Charmed. I've got to find this series to read one-time. I agree, It can't see it living up to the original series, so best to let Charmed stay ended. If they want to bring it back, I hope it happens when all of us are long gone, and all the original fans are dead or too old to watch. ESMERALDA SAID: Oh, that’s so cool that you’re also doing a marathon re-watch! We started ours when the rip-off (I refuse to call it either Charmed or the reboot..) got started and are almost done re-re-watching Season One and will start Season Two on Saturday October 12th and Sunday October 13th. Can’t wait! CARINA SAID: It is, and I'm so glad StoryGirl has created threads for all of Season One, so I can post my reviews here. ESMERALDA SAID: That is so exiting that you are going something similar. CARINA SAID: It is. I'm onto That Seventies Episode now. I've already posted my review for Something Wicca This Way Comes. ESMERALDA SAID: Can’t wait to read what you think of it! CARINA SAID: ESMERALDA SAID: Actually they’re all about the same age, but back when Charmed started, Ted LOOKED older than Phoebe. I could believe he was Prue’s age, but not Phoebe’s. CARINA SAID: I see, thanks, wasn't sure about how exact ages. ESMERALDA SAID: I’m not sure either; I just know they’re all close in age, but don’t look it. CARINA SAID: Okay. ESMERALDA SAID: Obviously I really think so – it’s the real reason why I matched them; I just didn’t want to spoil it after you read Season One and before you read Season Two. CARINA SAID: Thanks for doing that, was a nice surprise. ESMERALDA SAID: I’ll try to always do that. I’m glad it was a nice surprise. CARINA: It was. ESMERALDA SAID: Yeah, I hated them forcing that – it so took away from the fun of cliffhangers except (as you said) the Season Three one. I'm VERY curious to find out what you think of how I ended my Dream Season Three! CARINA SAID: Lets find out now, when I post Season Three in a new post. So this reply post doesn't get too long. ESMERALDA SAID: VERY good idea, especially because I have to get to work. I’ll let you know that I’m going to be VERY busy with Real Life this weekend, so if I don’t reply to you, that is why. If you have time, feel free to keep reading and replying – and putting each chapter in a different post so these don’t get too long is a fantastic idea! Have a great weekend! CARINA SAID: Thanks for letting me know, you are going to be busy this weekend. I will be on Saturday, I'm going to the Opera. So I'll be a bit busy that night with that, and then some dinner. Taking my mother out. After I'm done with this one, I'll be going and replying to Season Four. Thank you, have a great weekend too.
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Post by Carina on Sept 27, 2019 21:12:59 GMT -5
SEASON FOUR Starring Shannen Doherty, Holly Marie Combs and Alyssa Milano Costarring Brian Krause, Chris Boyd and Michael Bailey SmithThe season starts where we left off. Prue is evil and in the Underworld with Belthazor. Piper, Phoebe and Andy are near-death as we see their ghosts rise above their bodies. But Leo, who was also hurt, but not as badly, comes to and is able to stabilize Piper, Phoebe and Andy, using his doctor skills instead of the supernatural abilities he no longer has, before calling 911. CARINA SAID: This was pretty intense, because, Leo is helping them the human way, not using powers. This is more exciting. CARINA SAID: That would sure be a shock, that she enjoys being evil. CARINA SAID: I'm scared thinking that Belthazor is going to look like himself, what a way to frighten us, if I was watching. Then again, The Source just made me laugh, when I saw his face. Turning the magical community against them, especially Prue doing it. CARINA SAID: This is scary drama. CARINA SAID: CARINA SAID: I'm excited that Phoebe is putting her skills to good use than at a boring paper. CARINA SAID: Prue is pregnant, and glad she is back with her sisters. I'm glad they finally are able to do it. Not surprised, that they cant vanquish Belthazor just yet, and sets up Season Five well.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2019 23:36:53 GMT -5
And to make matters worse, Kernus waited until Shannen was on location, here in Canada, shooting a TV movie, and then had her fired over the phone.
Yeah, the gutless coward didn't have the guts to tell Shannen the news to her face.
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Post by Carina on Sept 30, 2019 5:03:11 GMT -5
TIM SAID: And to make matters worse, Kernus waited until Shannen was on location, here in Canada, shooting a TV movie, and then had her fired over the phone.
Yeah, the gutless coward didn't have the guts to tell Shannen the news to her face.
CARINA SAID: That is just so rude and horrible, do decency to do it in person. Of course, I don't blame Shannen for refusing to return to the series. I heard she was asked for Forever Charmed, but didn't like what the script had planned for her, good call Shannen. At least our memory of Prue can stay intact.
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Post by Carina on Sept 30, 2019 5:22:10 GMT -5
CARINA: I hope you had a good weekend Esmeralda. I had a wonderful time at the Opera on Saturday night, and last night got caught up watching some stuff on television, so didn't have a chance to come to Heritage. Going to continue where I left off now. Looking forward to hearing what you have to say with Season Three & Four and the other discussions when Real Life settles for you. SEASON FIVE Starring Shannen Doherty, Holly Marie Combs and Alyssa Milano Costarring Brian Krause, Chris Boyd and Michael Bailey Smith Piper and Phoebe are still having a hard time trusting Prue, and this trust is made far worse by the fact that Prue is still pregnant with Belthazor's child, and now magically eight months pregnant. Despite the fact that they beg her to get rid of it, she refuses because she already loves her unborn child. This weakens their bond and makes them vulnerable until halfway through the season when they finally forgive one another. CARINA SAID: Magically eight months pregnant, so we had a time jump already. I don't blame Prue for loving her unborn baby and wanting to protect it. But, I get why tension would happen between her and her sisters. CARINA SAID: Phoebe pregnant too. Oh wow! Hard to keep up with all of this, that I'm led to be suspicious, something bad will happen, this is too perfect for all the sisters. I like that, Piper isn't pregnant in this story, and her wedding is delayed from the original canon Season 3, since Piper's story got boring already once she got everything she wanted and got her happily ever after by Season Five, her character had not much to gain in development and excitement, at that point. I really think they rushed Piper's storyline far too fast, she had no payoff like you would if she got a marriage or child near the end of the series. CARINA SAID: Belthazor stop it, your scaring me. CARINA SAID: I like this, especially them being married in the 100th episode, than Season 3, and love that she gives birth to her child in this one too. Love the name Trish, that is the name of my aunt. CARINA SAID: I really love that you used the same spell, from 'That Seventies Episode'. CARINA SAID: Not surprised, always an attack when they are in the middle of something important. CARINA: No doubt about that. CARINA: Belthazor, is one nasty and scary demon. CARINA: CARINA SAID: Oh no!!! Panic-mode. CARINA SAID: Prue, oh no, NO, NOOOOO CARINA SAID: CARINA: Oh no, that image is too horrible, thank god this isn't on television, that image of Prue's body would be enough to make me turn the television off, but oh, was it a shock in the story. I knew it was too good to be true, the second I read earlier in the season with all the sisters being too happy, I knew something bad was coming. But, I'm really digging the idea of two sisters raising their niece, that is a cool idea to have them remember their sister through her daughter. I really like it, as it brings it back to Patty dying, and them being raised by Grams. Now Trish is the Phoebe, not having a mother growing and memories. Well, only two more seasons to go.
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Post by Esmeralda on Sept 30, 2019 7:14:06 GMT -5
ESMERALDA SAID: I've gotta get to work early today and I've been dying to find out what you think of my Dream Season Four, since it's when I really started doing things differently than canon. So I hope you don't mind if I read and reply to this this morning and reply to your earlier replies tonight. CARINA SAID: This was pretty intense, because, Leo is helping them the human way, not using powers. This is more exciting. ESMERALDA SAID: I'm glad you think so. It's part of why I took Leo's wings away and didn't give them back. CARINA SAID: That would sure be a shock, that she enjoys being evil. ESMERALDA SAID: Until they realize it's the potion that's making her do it. But I can just imagine how much fun Shannen would have, playing Prue like this. CARINA SAID: I'm scared thinking that Belthazor is going to look like himself, what a way to frighten us, if I was watching. Then again, The Source just made me laugh, when I saw his face. ESMERALDA SAID: I MUCH prefer the idea of Belthazor as the Big Bad here! SO much creepier than Half-Face! ---------------- CARINA: Turning the magical community against them, especially Prue doing it. ESMERALDA: Now to me, THAT's scary! CARINA SAID: This is scary drama. ESMERALDA SAID: Glad you think so. As you can tell, I love edge-of-your-seat drama! CARINA SAID: ESMERALDA SAID: A LOT scarier than Phoebe as Queen of the Underworld, huh? CARINA SAID: I'm excited that Phoebe is putting her skills to good use than at a boring paper. ESMERALDA SAID: Me, too. Working in the forensics department would NEVER turn her into a media darling. I HATED that PhoeME something awful! CARINA SAID: Prue is pregnant, and glad she is back with her sisters. ESMERALDA SAID: I like this way of getting her back much more than how they got Canon PhoeME back! CARINA SAID: I'm glad they finally are able to do it. Not surprised, that they cant vanquish Belthazor just yet, and sets up Season Five well. ESMERALDA SAID: I HATED that PhoeME's actions since 'Sleuthing with the Enemy' did not affect the Power of Three at all - when it did in 'Power Outage' and what PhoeME did, betraying the Power of Three should've. So it does in my version! Now can't wait to read what you think of Season Six!
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Post by Carina on Sept 30, 2019 22:11:19 GMT -5
ESMERALDA SAID: I've gotta get to work early today and I've been dying to find out what you think of my Dream Season Four, since it's when I really started doing things differently than canon. So I hope you don't mind if I read and reply to this this morning and reply to your earlier replies tonight. CARINA SAID: That's fine by me, I won't reply back to your comments on Season Four, and wait until you get caught up with all the older ones, so I'll just keep going and read Season Six one. ------------------------------- CARINA SAID: I love the parts with using Trish to cast the find a lost witch spell, and really loving Trish being raised by her aunts, it is such a fun story you did. CARINA SAID: I'm very happy you let the first two episodes be like that. I'm not a big fan of Charmed Again, partly for the way they mourned Prue so fast and brought in Paige, a huge slap in the face to fans, and like I said earlier, your story Our Screwed-Up Destiny is miles better. CARINA SAID: I love that she knew Prue for saving her life, than magically finding a funeral notice and coming to the funeral not knowing her. CARINA SAID: This is very cool. I'll always wonder if they may have originally intended to have Paige be the older half-sister, and a child Patty had before Victor, so we never had an affair, which I hated about Patty's character, I get why they did it, they got lucky with that episode. But I'm convinced if P3 H20 never existed, that is what they most likely would have done. Your Elders are good. YAY! CARINA SAID: Poor Phoebe, this is hearbreaking. CARINA SAID: I'm glad, her powers work like Prue's and not all those whitelighter powers, which made her not seem like a witch. Why are fans so obsessed with all of the additional powers. CARINA SAID: I like that the Seer is still around. CARINA SAID: This is very cool, and I like him watching and all. CARINA SAID: Again, this is the best thing I've never heard, I love them having a niece that reminds them of Prue. I can't see Brad Kern doing that. CARINA SAID: This feels so real, and not so unrealistic like Brad Kern with Paige made out to be family after what 3 months of knowing her. I don't like that. I like meeting Henry here. CARINA SAID: I'm glad they do, and that her old room is given to her, later in the season, not a a handful of episodes into S4. CARINA SAID: I'm glad they can now. CARINA SAID: I love this, and never liked the club, so I'm thrilled. CARINA: WHAT??? NO, WHY. This breaks my heart.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2019 23:26:30 GMT -5
Fan Fiction is one way we all show our loved for Charmed.
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Post by Esmeralda on Oct 1, 2019 7:19:06 GMT -5
SEASON FIVE Starring Shannen Doherty, Holly Marie Combs and Alyssa Milano Costarring Brian Krause, Chris Boyd and Michael Bailey Smith Piper and Phoebe are still having a hard time trusting Prue, and this trust is made far worse by the fact that Prue is still pregnant with Belthazor's child, and now magically eight months pregnant. Despite the fact that they beg her to get rid of it, she refuses because she already loves her unborn child. This weakens their bond and makes them vulnerable until halfway through the season when they finally forgive one another. CARINA: Magically eight months pregnant, so we had a time jump already. I don't blame Prue for loving her unborn baby and wanting to protect it. But, I get why tension would happen between her and her sisters. ESMERALDA: Nope, no time jump. Just like what happened with Canon Phoebe, the baby just grew faster. Only a month has passed. Maybe I didn't do a good job making that clear. CARINA: Phoebe pregnant too. Oh wow! Hard to keep up with all of this, that I'm led to be suspicious, something bad will happen, this is too perfect for all the sisters. ESMERALDA: You know us too well! ------------- CARINA: I like that, Piper isn't pregnant in this story, and her wedding is delayed from the original canon Season 3, since Piper's story got boring already once she got everything she wanted and got her happily ever after by Season Five, her character had not much to gain in development and excitement, at that point. I really think they rushed Piper's storyline far too fast, she had no payoff like you would if she got a marriage or child near the end of the series. ESMERALDA: Agreed completely totally. I can't figure out why they married them off so quickly. I think they made her pregnant that quickly in case the series would've ended after 'Witch Way Now' to set up a spin-off with the next generation. But I didn't like it. And hated it more when Wyatt Matthew was born rather than Prudence Melinda. CARINA: Belthazor stop it, your scaring me. ESMERALDA: Hehehehe! Isn't this better than whimpy Cole who turned into stalker Cole? CARINA: I like this, especially them being married in the 100th episode, than Season 3, and love that she gives birth to her child in this one too. Love the name Trish, that is the name of my aunt. ES: CARINA: I really love that you used the same spell, from 'That Seventies Episode'. ESMERALDA: I've always believed in "Why reinvent the wheel?" If something worked in the canon episode that is also one of my favorites, why not reuse it? CARINA: Not surprised, always an attack when they are in the middle of something important. ESMERALDA: Hehehehe, that's what makes it both scarier and more dramatic. And in case you haven't noticed, I like to do that in the 50th or 100th or 150th...episode - make them special. CARINA: No doubt about that. ESMERALDA: Which is one of the reasons I made her be the one who turned evil. CARINA: Belthazor, is one nasty and scary demon. ESMERALDA: Like I said before, I MUCH prefer this than how they handled Cole! CARINA: ESMERALDA: CARINA: Oh no!!! Panic-mode. ESMERALDA: Yup. CARINA: Prue, oh no, NO, NOOOOO ESMERALDA: I'm afraid so. I truly don't think Shannen would want to stick with the show any more than five seasons. But this is a better way of letting her go...especially now that you know who the innocent is. Did you suspect at all? CARINA: ESMERALDA: I like this better than what happened. Did you? CARINA: Oh no, that image is too horrible, thank god this isn't on television, that image of Prue's body would be enough to make me turn the television off, but oh, was it a shock in the story. I knew it was too good to be true, the second I read earlier in the season with all the sisters being too happy, I knew something bad was coming. ESMERALDA: Well, they'd never actually show her burnt body, just her sisters crying over it. But I still think it would be very dramatic and very sad. ----------------- CARINA: But, I'm really digging the idea of two sisters raising their niece, that is a cool idea to have them remember their sister through her daughter. I really like it, as it brings it back to Patty dying, and them being raised by Grams. Now Trish is the Phoebe, not having a mother growing and memories. ESMERALDA: Exactly so. Someone else did a Dream Charmed this way and I loved it so much that I had to include it in mine. ------------------ CARINA: Well, only two more seasons to go. ESMERALDA: Yup, and now you only have ONE more. I hope you'll like how I ended it!
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Post by Esmeralda on Oct 1, 2019 7:42:32 GMT -5
ESMERALDA: I've gotta get to work early today and I've been dying to find out what you think of my Dream Season Four, since it's when I really started doing things differently than canon. So I hope you don't mind if I read and reply to this this morning and reply to your earlier replies tonight. CARINA: That's fine by me, I won't reply back to your comments on Season Four, and wait until you get caught up with all the older ones, so I'll just keep going and read Season Six one. ESMERALDA: And like I said in the previous one, I think that's a fantastic idea, since I continue to be curious to see what you think. CARINA: I love the parts with using Trish to cast the find a lost witch spell, and really loving Trish being raised by her aunts, it is such a fun story you did. ESMERALDA: YAY! So glad you think so! CARINA: I'm very happy you let the first two episodes be like that. I'm not a big fan of Charmed Again, partly for the way they mourned Prue so fast and brought in Paige, a huge slap in the face to fans, and like I said earlier, your story Our Screwed-Up Destiny is miles better. ESMERALDA: YAY!!! SOOOO very glad you think so! And that brings it back to the story we're supposed to be discussing. Hehehehe! Like I said earlier, I hope it's helping distract you from what's happening in Real Life. CARINA: I love that she knew Prue for saving her life, than magically finding a funeral notice and coming to the funeral not knowing her. ESMERALDA: I hated that with a pure passion. There was really no reason for her to be there. CARINA: This is very cool. I'll always wonder if they may have originally intended to have Paige be the older half-sister, and a child Patty had before Victor, so we never had an affair, which I hated about Patty's character, I get why they did it, they got lucky with that episode. But I'm convinced if P3 H20 never existed, that is what they most likely would have done. ESMERALDA: Oh, yes! I HATED them making Patty as much of a Freebie as PhoeME! She was my favorite Charmed character up to that point, but that ruined her for me. DAMN YOU, KERN!! Especially not making Paige younger so Patty wouldn't be pregnant with Paige in that beautiful Christmas video! ------------------- CARINA: Your Elders are good. YAY! ESMERALDA: I thought Kern's Elders were more demonic than the demons! And in S6-8 they were just there for comedy, not much else. Just like Kern making us laugh AT the Charmed Ones, not laugh WITH them. OH, I hated that! In S7, I loved the demons (Kyra, Drake and Zankou) more than the Charmed Ones! I REALLY wanted Zankou to be the one who got to vanquish the Charmed Ones! And I wanted them to show that either Drake or Kyra was Phoebe's true love! CARINA: Poor Phoebe, this is heartbreaking. ESMERALDA: Yes, but that's Real Life, and I tried to make mine more realistic than what I call "The Perils of Poor, Poor Pitiful Piper" the alternate-universe spin-off that most fans think of as S4-8. CARINA: I'm glad, her powers work like Prue's and not all those whitelighter powers, which made her not seem like a witch. Why are fans so obsessed with all of the additional powers. ESMERALDA: Because Canon Charmed kept adding them - and I hear the ripoff is even WORSE at that! Not this girl! CARINA: I like that the Seer is still around. ESMERALDA: Yeah, they got rid of her much too soon! One of my all-time favorite villains along with Rex, Zankou, the Demon of Fear (not as Barbas...) and the warlock in 'Murphy's Luck' - all characters I LOVE to hate! CARINA: This is very cool, and I like him watching and all. ESMERALDA: He was easily the smartest of all the villains with Rex just a little behind and Cole a little behind him before he turned good, which, of course, I wish he hadn't. CARINA: Again, this is the best thing I've never heard, I love them having a niece that reminds them of Prue. I can't see Brad Kern doing that. ESMERALDA: Neither can I. But it's why I think it makes the most sense to have the one who is going to be gone to have the daughter - it keeps the series from being all about THAT sister, which I hated more than anything else. CARINA: This feels so real, and not so unrealistic like Brad Kern with Paige made out to be family after what 3 months of knowing her. I don't like that. I like meeting Henry here. ESMERALDA: I much prefer Henry over Glen, who seemed more like a friend than a boyfriend, the way I felt about Prue and Andy. BUT had Andy lived, I can see the storyline they used for Paige and Henry working for Prue and Andy. CARINA: I'm glad they do, and that her old room is given to her, later in the season, not a a handful of episodes into S4. ESMERALDA: And she's given the CHOICE, not forced! MAN, I hated Piper and Phoebe in the alternate-universe spin-off! Those are NOT the Piper and Phoebe I loved in S1-2! Some fans think the spin-off started when Piper exploded a watermelon or when PhoeME lied to her sisters about vanquishing Cole. I can accept either of those. CARINA: I'm glad they can now. ESMERALDA: CARINA: I love this, and never liked the club, so I'm thrilled. ESMERALDA: Me neither. If they really wanted to show off all of those groups, the sisters could've had a club where they liked to hang out, not being what Piper owned. CARINA: WHAT??? NO, WHY. This breaks my heart. ESMERALDA: Once you read Season Seven, you'll know why...
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Post by Carina on Oct 1, 2019 21:18:28 GMT -5
TIM SAID: Fan Fiction is one way we all show our loved for Charmed.
CARINA SAID: I couldn't agree more.
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Post by Carina on Oct 1, 2019 21:31:52 GMT -5
CARINA SAID: And I'm back for the reading of the final season. YAY!!! CARINA SAID: Now this is a good one, especially because they pick now to target Phoebe. I really love this idea. Yeah, The Avatar plot could have been so much fun featuring oeople who died alive again in that world. CARINA SAID: I love this, using her and not Drew Fuller. Well done, WELL DONE! CARINA SAID: Got a bit emotional her thinking about the wrong thing done for the right reason is still wrong. A great arc. CARINA SAID: She rejects them, we'll she ain't Chris. A much better actress in that role. CARINA SAID: Leo, WOW! Get answers. CARINA SAID: CARINA SAID: I love this so very much, especially making Chris the phoenix. Can I say, I wished this is what we got. It would make S6 more female centric, with a brand new female co-star, not another male co-star, Charmed always did. In that note, I hated that Charmed never had any female co-stars, apart from Billie in S8. For a female centric show, it always felt male centric with the sisters surrounded by male characters. CARINA SAID: YAY, now is the time for them to have children, near the end of the series. So happy she is a full-time social worker, why on earth did she quit, I blame you Kern. So glad Phoebe will not be dating, and instead take care of her iece and return to her police work, the best way to remember Andy and make him proud. CARINA SAID: I like that they make that decision to not unbound them. CARINA SAID: Paige the only survivor, well, that I like. CARINA SAID: Not wanting to let how if they succeeded, very well done. So much better. CARINA SAID: I love that the old sisters tell them this. What a way to honor the original Power of Three. I didn't like that Piper, Grams and Patty made up the power of three. CARINA SAID: So very happy, that they use that spell to send them home. CARINA SAID: A nice call back to when Prue died. CARINA SAID: I'm glad it is happy but not sappy. CARINA SAID: *Claps* Smiles and bows to completing this series. CARINA SAID: It sure did distract me, and I had fun reading it.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2019 23:27:28 GMT -5
My two Fan Fiction series is represented in my sig pic. There is the Rex and Hannah Chronicles, of course.
My other series, The Timelost, is a Doctor Who related one. The people pictured are my two main protagonists, Vince Hawkins and Sally Sparrow (Vince is from Classic Who and Sally is from Modern Who).
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Post by Esmeralda on Oct 2, 2019 7:53:30 GMT -5
CARINA: And I'm back for the reading of the final season. YAY!!! ESMERALDA: YAY! And I'm back to read your replies and reply to them! Been very curious to see what you think of my ending as compared to the canon one! CARINA: Now this is a good one, especially because they pick now to target Phoebe. I really love this idea. Yeah, The Avatar plot could have been so much fun featuring oeople who died alive again in that world. ESMERALDA: Glad you think so. It makes more sense than why they went after Leo. But, yes, that's why I had Zankou kill Andy, so I could have this. CARINA: I love this, using her and not Drew Fuller. Well done, WELL DONE! ESMERALDA: SOOOO glad you think so. It was one of my prime purposes - keeping the story female-centric. Guys are part of it, but females always star. I HATED Kern making Charmed male-centric - part of why I call those last five seasons an alternate universe. CARINA: Got a bit emotional her thinking about the wrong thing done for the right reason is still wrong. A great arc. ESMERALDA: Again, SO very glad that you think so! I HATED that the canon sisters could only care about their own losses (without ever mentioning Prue...) and couldn't care less what happened to the rest of the world! CARINA: She rejects them, we'll she ain't Chris. A much better actress in that role. ESMERALDA: Amen! Charisma did such a great job playing Kyra that I could immediately see as "Chris", and I tried to stick with people who actually appeared on Charmed. CARINA: Leo, WOW! Get answers. ESMERALDA: CARINA: ESMERALDA: CARINA: I love this so very much, especially making Chris the phoenix. Can I say, I wished this is what we got. It would make S6 more female centric, with a brand new female co-star, not another male co-star, Charmed always did. In that note, I hated that Charmed never had any female co-stars, apart from Billie in S8. For a female centric show, it always felt male centric with the sisters surrounded by male characters. ESMERALDA: And the sisters always dependent on their men. That I hated with a pure passion! Since you're now done, I decided to share something else - my reviews of the eight season...hope you like it, too! CARINA: YAY, now is the time for them to have children, near the end of the series. So happy she is a full-time social worker, why on earth did she quit, I blame you Kern. ESMERALDA: OOOOO, I blame him, too! And I agree - it doesn't make sense for them to try for children until the danger is over. Them trying for children during S4 made no sense at all! But for Kern's Piper, it was always all about what she wanted and feeling sorry for herself when she doesn't get it. --------------- CARINA: So glad Phoebe will not be dating, and instead take care of her niece and return to her police work, the best way to remember Andy and make him proud. ESMERALDA: Exactly so. I ABHORED the fact that after a Canon Charmed One lost the one who was supposed to be her great love, she almost immediately jumped into bed with someone else. With mine, they each have their great love and that's more than enough! CARINA: I like that they make that decision to not unbound them. ESMERALDA: I hated that Piper never bound her sons' powers or used the spell Grams used on the sisters in order to keep him (and later Chris) off Evil's radar. But, of course, that happened during the real Charmed and Kern always ignored that. CARINA: Paige the only survivor, well, that I like. ESMERALDA: To me that makes sense since she could panic-orb. And I admit that's the only reason why I let her have that at birth - so I could use it here. I would've preferred her not having ANY whitelighter powers, but just one, yeah, I could live with that. CARINA: Not wanting to let how if they succeeded, very well done. So much better. ESMERALDA: And, of course, they only found Leo and Piper. 'Forever Crap', I mean 'Forever Piper', I mean 'Forever Charmed' was SO the perfect finale of "The Perils of Poor, Poor Pitiful Piper" but NOT Charmed! CARINA: I love that the old sisters tell them this. What a way to honor the original Power of Three. I didn't like that Piper, Grams and Patty made up the power of three. ESMERALDA: I hated that, too. First because it was all about Piper and second because it's three SISTERS descended from Melinda Warren who could make up the Power of Three - NOT three generations - ESPECIALLY when two of them (Patty and Piper) had the same power! I did my own version of 'Forever Crap' and did a nod to 'That Seventies Episode' to solve this problem... CARINA: So very happy, that they use that spell to send them home. ESMERALDA: Unlike Kern, I don't forget the earlier episodes! Why reinvent the wheel? CARINA: A nice call back to when Prue died. ESMERALDA: I think it's a better one than the ones Kern used. CARINA: I'm glad it is happy but not sappy. ESMERALDA: I found the canon one EXTREMELY sappy that just made me roll my eyes. This would've brought tears to my eyes. CARINA: *Claps* Smiles and bows to completing this series. ESMERALDA: YAY!!! So very glad you think so!! CARINA: It sure did distract me, and I had fun reading it. ESMERALDA: SO very glad it did! And due to that and since you kept talking about how you preferred how I did things over how Kern did, as I said I would, I'm going to post my reviews of the eight seasons. I actually did them shortly after Charmed ended, but my reactions haven't changed much since then. It's up to you if you'd rather go back and reply to my replies. If you do, I'll do the same. If you decide to reply to my reviews, I'll reply to those first. All up to you!
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Post by Esmeralda on Oct 2, 2019 8:10:54 GMT -5
Here's my reviews of the seasons of Canon Charmed. I wrote them the summer after Charmed ended and my feelings towards them haven't changed much. About the only thing that changed was when the "Season 9" comics came out and I was so happy with the changes Paul Ruditis made that I had to add some of his changes to this.
I hope it helps distract you from Real Life the way "Our Screwed-Up Destiny" and my Dream Charmed did.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2019 11:15:03 GMT -5
The reason that happened is that Rose had to go film some scenes from a movie she was making at that time (Grindhouse). So Paige had to be temporarily written out.
You want the rat that sank the Charmed Sons ship, look no further than Forever Charmed. Especially that flash forward, that could have been cut out completely and nothing significant would be missing.
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Post by Carina on Oct 2, 2019 20:33:34 GMT -5
TIM SAID: The reason that happened is that Rose had to go film some scenes from a movie she was making at that time (Grindhouse). So Paige had to be temporarily written out.
CARINA SAID: Yeah, you can tell they were so keen to move on, why else look for other roles, when Charmed should have taken priority. I don't get why they didn't film out of order, so the finale could be sisterly centric, not Piper/Leo centric. That's why I can't stand Forever Charmed. CARINA SAID: I agree, I hated it so very much, that closes the door on any future, when they already explained what happens to them. I can see why Will and Grace, I heard un-did the flash forwards to bring it back. Any annoyance for me with Forever Charmed, was it was so Piper/Leo centric, that they are the last ones show walking up the steps of the manor old, that should have been all three sisters, in the present day. I roll my eyes at that. It is why, I much prefer Something Wicca This Way Goes? because it WAS sisterly centric, and the suspense with Zankou, kept me at the edge of my seat. Still not perfect, but miles better than Forever Charmed. If S7 was the end of Charmed, I'll wonder if the manor would be destroyed here, not just a basement.
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